Ironman MAngband

New ideas, features you wish were in the game.
Warrior
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Ironman MAngband

Post by Warrior » Tue 08.11.2005, 04:22

Continued from "Re: Full list of vault file issues"
http://www.mangband.org/cgi-bin/yabb/Ya ... 36;start=5

I see this has been discussed here earlier in the "Ironman setting" post.
http://www.mangband.org/cgi-bin/yabb/Ya ... 1038444393

Anyway, I think it'd be really cool to have a steady Ironman server up  ;D

I think I remember at least one Ironman competition a long time ago but I don't think we ever had a server up that lasted longer than a weekend or maybe a week. (besides catcarnage, but that was a variant/modified wasn't it?).

I think however there should be towns for every 1000ft, (could be made harder if towns were only at 1500-3000-4500-6000...) It'd make things really interesting, from town to 1500 in one dive is a big stretch, it'd feel like a real achievement, not to mention getting to the next town.

Shops should always carry enough of the stuff that you'll definitely need and (maybe) you should start with more gold. And another maybe - the deeper the town, the better the items in the shops. I don't really think prices should be changed, with 1500ft stretches you should be able to get lots of gold.

Not sure if any of this is in the Ironman mode already though.

However... one part of me wants it to be reaaaaally hard      
with absolutely no modifications to plain Ironman and the other wants it to be playable and enjoyable for most people.

Not sure -  if an Ironman server was to be put up, maybe we should vote,
  • "Hardcore" Ironman
  • "Friendly" Ironman
  • "Mixed" Ironman
Just a few thoughts

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Jug
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Tue 08.11.2005, 06:32

MAngband 0.7.2a monsters or Vanilla Angband 3.0.6 monsters ?

I'm guessing the latest Vanilla monsters make things a bit tougher ?

- Jug

Warrior
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Warrior » Tue 08.11.2005, 08:21

I haven't played angband since v 2.7.9 so I don't really know much about the new monsters, but - I can imagine the feeling if you've managed to get a good character going in Ironman, maybe got yourself down to 1500, nice gear and all that and then you run into a D of some kind that just looks like say, an ancient gold dragon, and it turns out to be a Wyrm of Thunder and you're squashed.

Especially since you've got limited resources I think it might be good to keep things simple, so you can focus on strategy instead of having to memorize all the new monsters.

But basically, if someone puts up a MIngband server with the new monsters I'm sure I'll play there, it's not that important.

:)

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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Avenger » Tue 08.11.2005, 11:56

I can't even beat normal MAngband, but hey, its an ironman server, it should be hard. My vote is hardcore.
BTW, thanks for all your work on MAngband Jug. Good to see it being developed again.
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Tue 08.11.2005, 16:18

Well, that's settled then.  Anything that's going to kill Warrior faster and give me more of a chance to beat him has to be good.  Angband 3.0.6 monsters it is. :-p

Thanks for your comments Avenger, I hope I meet you at 6350ft on the Ironman server real soon. :-)

- Jug

Warrior
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Warrior » Tue 08.11.2005, 17:41

It'll be cool to play on a fresh server again and even more so because its Ironman  8)

I think I've always enjoyed building a character more than actually being there, being level 50 with great gear isn't as exciting as being lvl 32 and finding something that changes everything.

In that respect, Ironman will feel very fresh, with no town and no houses there will be no level 50 characters (or lower for that matter) hoarding artifacts the way I guess they do at mangband.org.

Ironman MAngband might feel a bit more lonely than vanilla, no walking around in town, no selling this or selling that... but somehow that's a very important part of the game for me, to feel that -  it's just me, the little @ running over a screen that is mostly black. There's no world outside of it. Only tiny letters and darkness.

Hmmm...  If possible, maybe you should put restrictions on how many characters each player should be allowed, max 1 would be best, no need for multiple characters, if you already have a priest lvl 16 at 1200 ft and suddenly "wonder how a warrior would do"... just dive the hell out of the priest and start a warrior when you die :)

On another note... I have to agree wholeheartedly with Avenger, you're doing a great job Jug, having recently returned to the game myself I'm thrilled to see that I'm not as alone here as it seemed. The things you have achieved already, in relatively short time are very impressive and I hope that your interest in the game and community will stay a loooooong time.

[hr]

Hey ho, lets go!
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Jug
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Tue 08.11.2005, 19:35

Thanks Warrior.

The Ironman server should certainly stay pretty fresh I guess.  I imagine characters won't last too long, so the whole thing should be pretty fast paced.  The lonely darkness may be punctuated by that deep dark hidden town,  somewhere in the depths, where only the hardiest adventurers linger... ;)

So... the basic server is up, ironman.mangband.org.uk.  What I need to know is what is the minimum we need to make this server workable?  Everyone feel free to throw your ideas in!

What I have so far in terms of Ironman gameplay:

* You can only go down.
* You can't go out in the wilderness.
* There are no townies generated (to prevent farming townies) :)

What else do we need to get the thing off the ground?  Ideas from everyone welcome. :)

I already have on my todo list:

* Character dumps
* Online player ladder

- Jug

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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Tue 08.11.2005, 19:58

I suppose there should be no player ghosts?  Death is complete?  Or maybe ghosts can only go down?

- Jug

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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Warrior » Wed 09.11.2005, 04:49

Hmm, the score is influenced by max depth so because of that I guess there should be no ghosts.
Maybe if the max depth was to be taken away from from the score or ghost depth not being relevant... I like the idea of being a ghost and trying to get as deep as possible, maybe killing a few monsters on the way.
But it could be a little cheezy, a great ghost player like myself (cough) could squeeze more out of the ghost thing than many newbies who are only used to asking for resurrection where they died. So... depends really, but as long as resurrection is out of the question (also via life scrolls and such, of course) I think ghosts would add to the fun.

So my vote, Ghosts on, only down, no resurrection.

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Jug
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Wed 09.11.2005, 05:45

OK, that sounds good.  Until I get around to changing the scoring and disabling resurrection for Ironmen though, I've just disabled ghosts completely.

You die.  You're dead.

You still drop all your stuff, so player killing is a potential survival strategy.

- Jug

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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Wed 09.11.2005, 14:27

Well, the Ironman server is slowly taking shape.  Still not quite ready, but getting there.

For anyone following this thread, the Ironman Online Ladder is online at:

http://mangband.org.uk/ironman.php

- Jug

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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Avenger » Wed 09.11.2005, 18:25

There appear to be some graphics issues with the ironman server... among others, lights are not showing up and terrain features (walls, stairs, etc.) are in the wrong places. I don't think the problem's on my end since I can play the normal server without these difficulties.
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Wed 09.11.2005, 19:12

Hi Avenger.  Thanks for reporting the problem.  I've been looking into this.

I have checked all the save files on the server, they all work ok in my client.  It is possible that something very subtle is broken on the server, so subtle as to only break certain clients.  It should be pretty straightforward to fix once I can reproduce the problem.

Which operating system are you running on and which client are you using?

- Jug

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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Avenger » Wed 09.11.2005, 19:29

I'm using Windows 98, it's probably my client that's the problem. I still use 0.7.0-beta, since I prefer it to the newer clients.
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Re: Ironman MAngband

Post by Jug » Wed 09.11.2005, 20:12

In looking for the problem I have found a bug in the new save format, to do with players with spaces in their names (which yours did have).  I think I've fixed this problem now.

I'll download the version of the client you use and test it out tomorrow to make sure I've ironed out all the bugs.

- Jug

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